|
Post by flithops on Jun 30, 2013 6:43:34 GMT -8
Radusho, You are wrong about this. You cannot sell a CITES species from an old collection, but you can owe it! Read carefully the CITES convention and you will see... F.
|
|
|
|
Post by Adam Cotton on Jun 30, 2013 12:17:29 GMT -8
Look, I have read OUR legislative very carefully, so I know what I am talking about. That's the point I was trying to make earlier, each country enacted their own laws to comply with the CITES convention. Different countries treat ownership of old specimens differently under their laws. You have to comply with the legislation of the country you live in, regardless of the basic tenents laid down in the CITES regulations. Each signatory country has to AT LEAST comply with those, but their laws may be stricter than CITES requires. Adam.
|
|
|
Post by flithops on Jul 2, 2013 13:29:14 GMT -8
So, if you have some old specimens you have inhereted from someone, what do you do?
|
|
|
Post by mygala on Jul 2, 2013 17:32:37 GMT -8
You do not need a permit to own CITES listed species. Only to trade in them internationally. CITES is just a treaty organization, not an actual law enforcement organization. The "teeth", if you will, of CITES is in the wildlife law enforcement agencies of the various parties. Here in the US, it's the USFWS (although USDA and CBP also enforce CITES, because they are also customs type, law enforcement agencies). CITES Appendix II and III permits are export permits issued by the exporting country. CITES Appendix I is so restrictive that it requires both the export permit from the exporting country and an import certificate from the importing country.
People get other wildlife laws, like the Endangaered Species Act, confused with CITES. The ESA does prohibit the possession of certain items under some conditions. The other confusing law (at least here in the US) is the Lacey Act. A CITES violation could lead to a Lacey Act violation.
As far as older "Pre-CITES" materials, they need no certificates for ownership. But if you wish to trade them in international commerce, you still need a "Pre-CITES" certificate that attests to the fact that it was harvested before the CITES treaty was ratified. So really, in essence, you still need a CITES certificate, it's just that this one say "Pre-CITES". The Management Authority is supposed to determine whether you claim to the age of the item is true. In actuality, sometimes all they require is an affadavit from you for their records. It depends on the item and the country.
It gets confusing when you have more than one law at play. If you had a leopard skin the was from the 1950's, you could trade it internationally with a valid Pre-CITES certificate. But Leopards are also protected under the ESA, so if you tried to buy one from France and have it imported into the US, it would be seized because it's still covered by the ESA here. It has to be over 100yrs old to be exempt from that law. I find it all very confusing sometimes.
|
|
|
Post by Christof on Jul 5, 2013 15:59:36 GMT -8
I am really surprised to read that hospiton is common in Corsica! To my experience that is not correct. Yes, there are areas where it flies but even there it is far from common! And there are a few areas where it used to fly and you cannot find them there anymore. Attachment Deleted
|
|
|
Post by wollastoni on Jul 17, 2013 13:40:56 GMT -8
Still some hospiton offered on Ebay with many bids ... Beware hospiton, even if not rare in Corsica and Sardegna, is still a CITES 1 species !
|
|
|
|
Post by suzuki on Jul 31, 2013 9:34:49 GMT -8
Well another pair of the Corsican swallowtail is again on ebay but at a slightly cheaper price than the previous pair from the same seller.No problems then!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2013 9:47:47 GMT -8
is there a link to the item?
|
|
iroki
Full Member
Posts: 73
|
Post by iroki on Jul 31, 2013 15:05:54 GMT -8
|
|
|
Post by papiliotheona on Jul 31, 2013 17:45:30 GMT -8
I am with Adam Cotton. CITES (and all collecting laws) are pretty (and expensive) systems that were put in place to protect developers and commercial interests from having to do anything to mitigate their activities. We are a very convenient scapegoat.
|
|
|
Post by lordpandarus on Aug 2, 2013 23:46:58 GMT -8
I wouldn't desire this species enough to risk buying it
to me it looks like a small P. machaon
|
|
|
Post by mantisboy on Aug 8, 2013 5:31:04 GMT -8
|
|
|
Post by suzuki on Aug 8, 2013 6:15:44 GMT -8
Nice ones too even if from an old collection. Interesting though that none of the various sellers use the correct descriptive titles for their specimens. Modesty I think not!
|
|
|
Post by Dany on Aug 13, 2013 1:38:41 GMT -8
I am really surprised to read that hospiton is common in Corsica! To my experience that is not correct. Yes, there are areas where it flies but even there it is far from common! And there are a few areas where it used to fly and you cannot find them there anymore. I have the same experience here in Sardinia... Here is a larva and here a wild hybrid hospiton x machaon Cheers Daniele
|
|
|
Post by suzuki on Aug 13, 2013 1:51:18 GMT -8
Does the hybrid larva have the same parasitic problem as the larva of hospiton?
|
|