777
Full Member
Posts: 113
Country: United States
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Post by 777 on Aug 30, 2019 21:03:27 GMT -8
Lots of people think that butterflies are the most innocent creatures in the world and that we are monsters for killing them. Seeing a lot of people with this mindset, I wonder if any members in this forum have been confronted by people who dislike butterfly collectors. If you have, feel free to share your story.
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Post by miguel on Aug 31, 2019 0:23:23 GMT -8
Yes,so many years ago I was collecting in a mountain and two persons arrived to the place where I was and throot me with to reportme to the local autorities,I wasn´t worried cause I was outside a Park and the people concerned to protect that place knew that I was there collecting.
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Post by bichos on Aug 31, 2019 2:54:26 GMT -8
So much so that I don't collect them anymore.
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Post by joniverson on Aug 31, 2019 3:18:21 GMT -8
Hate to say it, but just this Summer, not only was I confronted, but I got a fine! I did not realize that the piece of land I was collecting on was also a reserve! First citation for anything other than speeding, tried to reason with the ranger, but he wouldn't budge. Lesson learned to always inquire first before collecting. One reason I made the three bait traps for my backyard so there aren't any more issues. All my neighbors are aware of the traps and their purpose and no one says anything. After the reserve incident, I was so angered that I came home and tore out both of my Buddleias by hand. That was a mistake and I regretted it a week later. Next Spring, a new one will be in the ground where the former had been.
In the US, I think I see a day coming there where collecting leps will be illegal or special permits will be required. Many other things have gone this way. It's not only about conservationists, but others getting a "cut".
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Post by jshuey on Sept 1, 2019 14:11:23 GMT -8
I've collected for over 40 years, and the answer is nope. I once had a guy in the Dominican Republic demand money, and A CO claim I was poaching (until he realized that my employer owned the land we were standing on) but that's as close as it's ever been.
I always have permission and permits (if required).
john
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Post by joniverson on Sept 2, 2019 4:18:54 GMT -8
Just a question, why not photograph living bugs and put them back where you found them when you are done? I have been doing that for years and people have never looked down on me. I even do it in parks! After my incident, I have started photographing more. In fact, even some of the leps I am acquiring from the traps I have been temporarily releasing into a tent so I can photograph before releasing. So it is an option although I have to admit I do find it quite challenging unless lucky enough to find a lep when its cold. |
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777
Full Member
Posts: 113
Country: United States
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Post by 777 on Sept 2, 2019 9:50:03 GMT -8
I think most people look at it like this: There are 330,000,000 people living in the USA. There are 400 salt creek tiger beetle's left in the wild. Lets say there are 100,000 people who collect bugs? Well you do the math. Just a question, why not photograph living bugs and put them back where you found them when you are done? I have been doing that for years and people have never looked down on me. I even do it in parks! I understand how angry people would feel about endangered insects like the salt creek tiger beetle, but when it comes to butterflies, it does not matter how rare or common a butterfly species is. People will get offended if you kill a butterfly because butterflies are cute and pretty, and there will be some people that will argue and give a lecture to why we should not kill them (even though they probably kill spiders for how ugly they are). Photographing butterflies has nice benefits, like photographing them in their natural habitat, or recording their natural behavior in a visual way. Despite the benefits of photographing insects, I personally would rather capture and collect them because it brings more excitement to me, and my collection can be donated when I die. There are many ways to record insects, and it is up to a person to find out which technique suits himself/herself best. |
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Post by rayrard on Sept 2, 2019 10:17:59 GMT -8
The problem is that they won't even allow you to set up a light in state parks even if you obviously just photographing them. I was in a PA state park this summer and I was staying in the campsite as a paid guest, and I took my light far away from the campsites to avoid disturbing campers. I still had a gruff ranger come by and order me to take the light down even though I wasn't collecting anything. His excuse was "this part of the park is closed after dark" (outside guests sure, but I am staying in the park) and the usual permit nonsense which should only apply to killing insects in the park. It was frustrating how even observation of insects is becoming difficult.
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Post by Paul K on Sept 2, 2019 10:44:37 GMT -8
The problem is that they won't even allow you to set up a light in state parks even if you obviously just photographing them. I was in a PA state park this summer and I was staying in the campsite as a paid guest, and I took my light far away from the campsites to avoid disturbing campers. I still had a gruff ranger come by and order me to take the light down even though I wasn't collecting anything. His excuse was "this part of the park is closed after dark" (outside guests sure, but I am staying in the park) and the usual permit nonsense which should only apply to killing insects in the park. It was frustrating how even observation of insects is becoming difficult. In his opinion you could collect when he would leave and he was not up to supervise you all night as he had more important tasks to do later on: sleep. I said it before and I will say it again: insects don't need protection, habitats do. We need protected areas such National Parks but collecting of insects which can reproduce in mass should be allowed inside. Perhaps by permit which should be easy to obtain/purchase similar to fishing, hunting permits. Sighting or photographing very often can't be confirmed or species can't be verified only from photo therefore they have no scientific value. There are many new cryptic species which are recently discovered by examination of genitals or DNA. How this can be done with even the best photo? |
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Post by miguel on Sept 2, 2019 11:45:29 GMT -8
I´m tired of people telling and thinking that they love more nature by the thing that they go out and make photos and do not collecting,maybe they kill more insects with their cars than me with my net.
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Post by exoticimports on Sept 3, 2019 13:05:07 GMT -8
I think most people look at it like this: There are 330,000,000 people living in the USA. There are 400 salt creek tiger beetle's left in the wild. Lets say there are 100,000 people who collect bugs? Well you do the math. Just a question, why not photograph living bugs and put them back where you found them when you are done? I have been doing that for years and people have never looked down on me. I even do it in parks! Because photos are often insufficient to ID the specimen. Aside from which there is no harm in collecting. If collecting were allowed in Yellowstone and all tourists were banned, would not the environment be improved? After all, there’s no reason to allow hikers or tourists, there are plenty of photos of Old Faithful. |
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Post by wingedwishes on Sept 3, 2019 13:33:18 GMT -8
I hear it about once a month while selling framed insects. Usually I can explain that I release many of what I raise to buoy local populations followed by explaining that I volunteer to teach about insects in local schools as well as teach gardening to increase wild populations. When my 12 year old daughter also shows jewelry she has made from wings she removes from car grills and road kills then often a thank you follows. Sometimes even a sale. I suppose it helps that I retired from being an ACO 5 years ago too.
Ty
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Post by papilio28570 on Sept 25, 2019 19:46:35 GMT -8
I just tell folks I am doing an insect survey and the net is used to help in positive identification.
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Post by jhyatt on Sept 26, 2019 5:17:20 GMT -8
It's not an issue for me. I've been "confronted" by people who are curious about what I'm doing and why, but seldom (actually, never to the best of my
memory) who complain about my activities. Guess I collect mainly in places where people are pretty sensible, and I'm careful to stay out of people's private flower
gardens, etc. Most folks I talk to while collecting think it's an odd thing to do... but in South America, collecting back in the '80's seemed to be a not-unusual
activity, and people there sometimes offered information on where they had recently seen lots of mariposas.
jh
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2019 9:00:16 GMT -8
When people come up, usually out of curiosity, I simply say I’m a retired biology teacher doing research work. No problems. A few times late at night a conservation officer or county/state police officer stop to see that I’m legit. For the state parks, I have permits as needed just in case. Now.....if I got a buck for every weird look or comment made by passers by, I’d be a multi-millionaire. Interestingly, the one time I did have people bother me was when I exhibited my collection in a gallery of a university. I had many people, both orally and in the guestbook, accuse me of being a butterfly murderer. Needless to say, I’ve not exhibited since and probably won’t again.
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