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Post by thanos on Jul 8, 2011 1:48:34 GMT -8
Hello all, I need help from some of you who have VERY good eye.Please check carefully these 2 photos below,and tell me if you think that these 2 females of Lucanus cervus akbesianus are finally the same specimen. I think they are the same,as I found many extreme similarities,which are impossible to occur between 2 different specimens. I think that just on the second photo the legs have been moved a little.. I won the specimen of the first picture on ebay few days ago and paid immediately. And today I saw the specimen of the second picture listed for sale on ebay by the same seller. It looked to me very similar to the specimen I won(of the first photo),so I compared carefully the 2 photos and found extreme similarities,as I told above. I contacted the seller and he told me that it is a different specimen,and that he already sent mine to my address,giving me also a tracking number. But I still think that these specimens are the same one.. Please help and tell me what you think. Thank you. Thanos Attachments:
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Post by thanos on Jul 8, 2011 1:54:41 GMT -8
Here the second photo. Attachments:
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Post by lordpandarus on Jul 8, 2011 2:47:03 GMT -8
As far as I can see the legs look spread differently . And the little mouth things are different. there's also a "wrinkle" in the shell of the bottom one I can't see on the top one
I would say they are different unless they weren't "dry" when he took the pictures and he's purposefully misleading you, which doesn't seem likely
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Post by africaone on Jul 8, 2011 3:30:00 GMT -8
they look very very similar ! and typical two fotos of the same specimens (undried).
Spines on the legs are like fingerprint in some Lucanid ! here they look so similar + some others details !
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Post by downundermoths on Jul 8, 2011 4:15:43 GMT -8
I have re-orientated, made sizes similar and stitched them together...and have examined them under x3 mag... In my opinion they are the same beetle... Barry Attachments:
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Post by lordpandarus on Jul 8, 2011 6:16:25 GMT -8
I guess he'll find out when he receives it
but it still would be a concern when bidding if it is the "real specimen"
i have seen some dealers re-use photos of butterflies, but not to deceive, but just because they are confident of the quality and were to lazy to take a new picture
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Post by thanos on Jul 8, 2011 15:11:51 GMT -8
Thank you all guys very much for your time and input !!
Thierry,you are right,I also had noticed these details with the spines on tibias(especially in middle leg pair,the left tibia has 4 spines,while the right has 3...,and this is the same in the 2 specimens!).Also,some other extreme similarities in other details as you said,like some lines on elytra and head..
Barry,thank you for this photo test !
This seller,as far as I know,is hunting almost daily L.cervus during their season and he offers very oftenly during spring/summer very fresh specimens,not dried yet.. Mouth parts like the maxillae or palpi oftenly move a little and change position when the specimen starts drying..So,it's clear that it is the same specimen,undried,and that he moved the legs and relisted it....while I won and paid for it immediately...! This is unbelievable and the first time that this happens to me.But why he did this..?
And even more unbelievable is that he told me that is another specimen the one that he relisted, and that he gave me tracking number..Which is either fake,or he is sending me something else..
lordpandarus,yes,many sellers use the same photo as an example,cause they are confident of the quality of their specimens,BUT this is totally different...This seller sells the actual specimens,and told me(lies) that he relisted another specimen,and he gave me tracking number..!
Anyway,I know what to do. I will give him some days so to see if I will receive a package and what specimen I will receive.. I already just tracked the number that he gave me with the online postage page and no results found....(but maybe it is early).
If I will not receive my item,I will leave negative feedback for this behaviour,I will use buyers protection on ebay to get my money back and...I will post also in the insect trading reports section about this.
His ID on ebay is : 'manticora2010' and he is 'Murat Ali' from Turkey.
Thanos
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Post by lordpandarus on Jul 8, 2011 15:40:17 GMT -8
I don't think you will be getting screwed, that is my prediction. He is probably made a small photo selection mistake and tried to "cover it up" but dug himself into a hole
I would give the normal time for the parcel to arrive, inspect the specimen you have and if you are happy with it just not look into the matter further.
I am VERY lenient with ebay sellers , maybe too much. I have never given a negative or neutral. In fact I just got a parcel of badly damaged material but fixing it in private
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Post by thanos on Jul 9, 2011 17:40:02 GMT -8
Update: Cause I like to be right with everyone : Murat(the seller) told me that finally thinks that I'm right,that he was confused cause he has some specimens of the same size,and he apologized for this mistake. He told me the he has already sent me a parcel with 1 female of the same size,to which he included a free female as a gift to me..And also that he will send me on monday second parcel with the actual female I won(he has removed the specimen from ebay,although it had bids,so to send also this to me). I told him that now I understood,that is Ok,and that I will have to send him extra money when I will receive the parcels,cause I don't want in any case to benefit myself from this mistake,and to get 3 females,while I paid for 1. Ok,I already wrote a lot for this here( here is not insect trading reports) - excuse me for this.
Thanos
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