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Post by trehopr1 on Sept 9, 2020 14:50:02 GMT -8
Thank you very much Bill !
I know your diagram will certainly help me in discerning these two species apart.
Thank you for sharing !!
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Post by trehopr1 on Sept 10, 2020 10:56:56 GMT -8
I have a friend who sent me this picture today of 3 Catocala which he would like identified. Right away I thought the (top) and (middle) one look most like Catocala retecta (Yellow-gray underwing). The bottom one however, I cannot discern. Would anyone be able to forward any opinions on that one ? Also, if you should disagree with my det. of C.retecta for the first two then please elaborate... *Author's Note: Species (determinations) are courtesy of *rayrard Top: Catocala flebilis / Mourning Underwing Middle: Catocala retecta / Yellow-gray Underwing Bottom: Catocala obscura / Obscure Underwing
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Post by rayrard on Sept 10, 2020 11:20:15 GMT -8
We need location for those. But by appearance:
C. flebilis (reniform is too gray though but the fringe is wrong for angusi) C. retecta C. obscura
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Post by trehopr1 on Sept 10, 2020 11:37:38 GMT -8
Top specimen: Southern Illinois
Middle specimen: Southern Wisconsin
Bottom specimen: Southern Wisconsin
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Post by trehopr1 on Sept 10, 2020 11:57:39 GMT -8
Thank you Rayrard for your thoughtful expertise. That is a very good observation regarding that large reniform spot on that top specimen. It is noticeably different than that of the middle specimen. I noticed that both specimens have a rather hook shaped marking below the reniform spot but, clearly the color and size of the spots are different.
Although my picture does not show it the bottom specimen does have gunmetal colored four wings; that is they have a bluish sheen overlaying the whole of the gray four wings
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2020 12:23:03 GMT -8
We need location for those. But by appearance: C. flebilis (reniform is too gray though but the fringe is wrong for angusi) C. retecta C. obscura +1
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Post by rayrard on Sept 10, 2020 14:56:51 GMT -8
retecta/luctuosa are difficult but I think Wisconsin is far north for that and that is usually more yellowish-gray
residua/obscura have nice iridescent sheens when fresh
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Post by trehopr1 on Sept 10, 2020 17:02:46 GMT -8
Rayrand, the retecta ( middle specimen) was collected in Sauk Co., Wisconsin. Looking at a county map of Wisconsin it is one of the southwest counties of the state.
There is a lot more tree cover and wild spaces in Wisconsin as compared with my state of Illinois. , If that is a little far north for the species then I suppose he is fortunate in having caught it since, it may well be at the extreme reach of its range there.
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leptraps
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Post by leptraps on Sept 11, 2020 6:33:17 GMT -8
Mothman27:
That is a nice collection of Catocala. I only collect fourteen (14) species in NE Ohio to date.
I also collected four (4) species in South eastern Coloroda, two (2) spieces in the Fort Morgan/Roggens area of Colorado. One species in NW Kansas and another in Oklahoma.
I visited Killdeer Plains Wildlife Area (Killdeer WA got a new name for 2020, it is now Killdeer Plains WA) this AM and checked my Bait Traps and four Light Traps I set out last night. The Bait Traps had numerous but worn Catocala. I had numerous females but not a keeper in the lot. I was inundated with Apamea helva, Resapamea stipata and Lithophane semiusta in the Bait Traps. All were immaculate. The Resapamea stipata was new for me.
I also Baited a number of trees. This AM I lifted tree bark and collected several winter/cold weather moths including several Seraglea.
I stopped at "The Coffee Shop" in Little Sandusky on my way home. I saw a moth on the window on the side of the Coffee Shop. A very nice Eupsilia devia. I also found a Lithophane querquera, also in excellent condition. Driving home on US30, I drove through a down pour. I actually stop under an overpass and sat until it slowed down.
I also stopped at the Sears Wood SNP west of Bucyrus. Although collecting is not permitted, just walking through the ancient forest was worth the stop. I may apply for a research permit and see what is there.
I designed a Light Trap and a method of deploying the Light Trap in the Canopy. I used it several times in 2018 while conducting a Lepidoptera Survey in Central Indiana. The Sears Wood SNP might be an excellent place to try it out again.
I will ask the question again. Has anybody ever surveyed the insects in the Canopy?
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Post by trehopr1 on Sept 11, 2020 10:51:35 GMT -8
Leptraps, I imagine very, very few collectors, hobbyists, or enthusiasts have ever endeavored in any sort of canopy collecting or "surveying" --- not that its a bad idea. It just requires more time and effort to set-up a rigging (using ropes, pulleys, etc.); to get a trap up into a suitable canopy environment. Quite frankly, most collectors would just a soon bounce their light rig, bait trap, light trap, or what have you out onto an earthly (terrestrial) plane for their "small game" hunting activities.
However, I can tell you that in the late 1980's and 1990's an entomologist associated with the Smithsonian Institution was down in Peru (and perhaps some other countries) doing Canopy "fogging". His name is Terry Irwin and he perfected a method of mass surveying of a given locale using a "cattle barn" fogger of the (industrial use) type.
A cattle barn fogger as you probably know is a man portable "pyrethrum fogger". It has a thick strap which you sling over one shoulder as the device rests next to your hip. It has a 4ft. long barrel through which the pyrethrum flows and is converted into a gas. Its a "terribly" loud beast which is gas powered. I suppose much like an "amped-up" leaf blower...
Anyway, terry and his team would hoist one of these weighty "bazooka's" into the canopy of a large rainforest tree (using a rope and pulley system). Beneath, the device they would put in place some manner of sheeting (either thin tarps or king size bedsheets); to cover as much of the area beneath the tree as possible; allowing only "channels" wide enough to walk through. Once, all was in place the team would wake very early the following morning (like 3 a.m.) when the air was heavy with moisture and still.
Then the fogger would be fired up and the ensuing pyrethrum fog would "hang" in the canopy where its "knockdown" effect became readily apparent. An insect "rain" (deluge) would very soon be upon them. The sheeting caught the ensuing biomass and within 15 minutes or so a contingent of workers were collecting up and / or bottling up everything possible. Using this method, he was able to do a rapid assessment of the localized fauna. Enough work really for the coming years...
One article which I read reported that he had found nearly 40 species of ant on just ONE rainforest tree ! Based upon several such surveys which he conducted he theorized that our estimates of possible insect species is far TOO low. He thought that perhaps as many as 10 million species of insect might be possible based upon his incredible diversity findings.
I don't know if such surveying has continued into the decade of the 2000's but, YES canopy surveying has been done with great success by the Smithsonian team of entomologists.
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Post by trehopr1 on Sept 11, 2020 10:59:08 GMT -8
For a quick preview of this method check out the first 15 minutes or so of the movie Arachnophobia. There you will see the method in action. Quite EXCITING really for a real enthusiast...
There may be a clip on youtube or the like as well these days.
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leptraps
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Post by leptraps on Sept 11, 2020 13:12:44 GMT -8
I googled it with virtually no response or related articles. I actually made two Light Traps that I raised into the canopy of a mature forest. Once I managed to place one about 75 feet or more into the Canopy, I had to solve several issues/problems. I shot the tether line with a crossbow and arrow that I found at Wal-Mart. Once the tether was in place a second tether was attached to the first tether. This tether was a combination of power cable and the permanent suspension cord. This cord remained in the tree. The tether line with the power cord was lowered and the Light Trap was attached with a Dog Snap. The ballast was attached to the Top Cap of the Light Trap. Raised into place, it remained all night in the Canopy. The Light Trap had a PES (Photoelectric Switch) which turned the Light Trap on at dark and off at daylight. I used it several times. I just left the tether/power cord in the tree for almost seven (7) months. I did however, use it a couple dozen times. I found some things more abundant in the Canopy than down below. I also sent large numbers of Micro moths to specialist for ID's. Also, I had more female moths in the Canopy Light Trap than I ever had in Light Traps on the ground.
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Post by exoticimports on Sept 11, 2020 14:15:12 GMT -8
HEY! Yeah, I yelled to get your attention.
I think it would be a good idea if those who had specimens identified to go back and edit the original post to include the ID.
That way we can reference the ID without searching in subsequent posts.
Thanks,
Chuck
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Post by trehopr1 on Sept 11, 2020 14:33:28 GMT -8
Leptraps, very nice to hear that you had a measure of success in capturing things which you normally will not have collected using any terrestrial traps. Fascinating.
Your process for rigging sounds well worked out and it certainly brought out the adventurer in you !
If you should ever try it again in the future than please, let us know what sort of findings you make.
It is an innovative and interesting method of surveying/collecting !
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Post by trehopr1 on Sept 11, 2020 14:39:46 GMT -8
Exoticimports, a very good idea indeed. Sorry I didn't think of it. I am very grateful however, for all of the great help which I have received from *billgarth and *rayrard with these moths.
I will endeavor tonight to place the ID's which have been made on the respective posts since thus far I have been the one leaving most of the pictures...👍😊
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