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Post by Adam Cotton on May 8, 2021 7:23:56 GMT -8
I have been asked to post information about this event: www.sbbt.org.uk/our-projects/saving-swallowtails-conference-12-june-2021/The Swallowtail and Birdwing Butterfly Trust is pleased to announce an online videoconference on "Saving Swallowtails", highlighting some of the most important and progressive butterfly conservation projects in the world. There will be two sessions run at different times. The Eastern Timezone conference is outlined in the orange box below. Beneath that is the Western Timezone conference, outlined in the green box. Both conferences may be booked through Eventbrite simply by searching Saving Swallowtails on the Eventbrite webpage. Registration is easy via Eventbrite and it's free for students. SBBT are inviting just £10 contributions from everyone else to help cover costs, but they say they will not refuse anyone even if they cannot pay. Any surplus would of course go towards the charitable activities of the Trust, all of which are focused on practical conservation, education, and raising awareness of conservation needs.   |
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Post by Adam Cotton on May 24, 2021 0:27:41 GMT -8
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Post by papiliotheona on Jun 7, 2021 15:49:12 GMT -8
I am legitimately curious Adam--will this conference offer something OTHER than anti-collecting demagoguery?
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Post by exoticimports on Jun 7, 2021 17:37:21 GMT -8
He has a point. The greatest threat to homerus is deforestation. And I’m guessing the number of British swallowtails threatened be sea rise is about six. Six individuals.
Chuck
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Post by Adam Cotton on Jun 8, 2021 1:13:55 GMT -8
I am legitimately curious Adam--will this conference offer something OTHER than anti-collecting demagoguery? I very much doubt that "anti-collecting demagoguery" will be anywhere in sight. This is not being organised by PETA, Greenpeace or some other activists. Most of the speakers are scientific researchers, and they generally appreciate the efforts of collectors in providing specimens for study. Adam. PS. I should add that I am not involved in organising the event, so I have no direct involvement. |
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Post by Adam Cotton on Jun 8, 2021 1:17:36 GMT -8
He has a point. The greatest threat to homerus is deforestation. And I’m guessing the number of British swallowtails threatened be sea rise is about six. Six individuals. Chuck I agree with the first point but the comment about the British swallowtail is absolutely wrong. Unlike P. machaon in Europe, subspecies britannicus is only found in small areas of the Norfolk Fens and their marshy habitat is at sea level. Increases in sea level bring salt into the marshes, and plants die as a result. If their host plants or nectar plants all die, so will the subspecies. Adam. |
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Post by exoticimports on Jun 8, 2021 4:45:39 GMT -8
Some suggested papers that might make a difference:
Termination of habitat loss in Indonesia with economical, safe Tomahawk missiles, CENTCOM
Correlation of capital punishment for manufacture or use of charcoal in India with environmental recovery, Bureaucrats of India
Civil War: the singular most effective means for rainforest regrowth? Francis Ona
Termination of population of Exodus from California and New York to reduce new housing development in sane states, US Census Bureau
Bounties on politicians prove immediately effective in preserving rainforest in Brazil, Buncha Villagers
A completely novel, unheard of idea: subsidizing wildlife trade development as an alternative to deforestation in the Popondetta region, USFWS
Saving continental US ecosystems by eliminating Bureau of Land Management and surrendering control to Canada, Canada
Deploying all staff to field research and protection: a bureaucrat's nightmare but ecologist's dream: CITES
Teaching Schaus' Swallowtail to live somewhere it won't get creamed by hurricanes, Weather Channel
Global Warming makes Toronto 97% compatible with Schaus' Swallowtail needs, Tourism Canada
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Post by jshuey on Jun 8, 2021 5:43:00 GMT -8
Some suggested papers that might make a difference: Termination of habitat loss in Indonesia with economical, safe Tomahawk missiles, CENTCOM Correlation of capital punishment for manufacture or use of charcoal in India with environmental recovery, Bureaucrats of India Civil War: the singular most effective means for rainforest regrowth? Francis Ona Termination of population of Exodus from California and New York to reduce new housing development in sane states, US Census Bureau Bounties on politicians prove immediately effective in preserving rainforest in Brazil, Buncha Villagers A completely novel, unheard of idea: subsidizing wildlife trade development as an alternative to deforestation in the Popondetta region, USFWS Saving continental US ecosystems by eliminating Bureau of Land Management and surrendering control to Canada, Canada Deploying all staff to field research and protection: a bureaucrat's nightmare but ecologist's dream: CITES Teaching Schaus' Swallowtail to live somewhere it won't get creamed by hurricanes, Weather Channel Global Warming makes Toronto 97% compatible with Schaus' Swallowtail needs, Tourism Canada I get it, conservation is a bad thing. And then we wonder why collectors get a bad rap from the general public... John |
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Post by papiliotheona on Jun 8, 2021 7:35:10 GMT -8
He has a point. The greatest threat to homerus is deforestation. And I’m guessing the number of British swallowtails threatened be sea rise is about six. Six individuals. Chuck I agree with the first point but the comment about the British swallowtail is absolutely wrong. Unlike P. machaon in Europe, subspecies britannicus is only found in small areas of the Norfolk Fens and their marshy habitat is at sea level. Increases in sea level bring salt into the marshes, and plants die as a result. If their host plants or nectar plants all die, so will the subspecies. Adam. Yet ssp. britannicus is protected from COLLECTING in England. Because, some kid with a net controls the climate, right? Conservationists and the regimes they create are steaming piles of BS and hypocrisy through and through. |
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Post by exoticimports on Jun 8, 2021 7:45:00 GMT -8
I get it, conservation is a bad thing. And then we wonder why collectors get a bad rap from the general public... John For the life of me, I cannot fathom how here, a forum inundated with the scientifically minded, there prevails tendencies to over-react and twist others' posts to infer some far-reaching point. That's why I hate Twitter- everyone just has to post something, and half the time it's fraudulent, intentional manipulation of a prior statement. One would hope we'd be above that, but time and time again, it's been disproven. Not to harp a point, but show me where I said conservation is a bad thing. Perhaps I misread my own post (and some are a bit tongue in cheek) however, arguably all would be effective- in fact, more effective than what is being done now, by and large. Not to discredit those who do what they can. The fact remains though that a bounty on politicians forcing logging in the Brazilian rainforest would be far more effective than waggling on about the rare papilio we know are there. And, if you want to save pangolins, three conventional Tomahawks into personal compounds in China and/or Malaysia would work wonders. The fact is that deforestation is the #1 threat vector to most wildlife, including Papilio. Yet somehow, nobody cares, and no government is willing to do anything about it. The general public is enamoured with hit pieces in NatGeo that tug on their heartstrings, but doesn't care about deforestation so long as they get their palm oil and cheap lumber. Some of the cited papers probably are valid, and useful. However, some are narrow-minded, like worrying about a cut when you're having a heart attack. Global warming harming a birdwing on Kinabalu? How about the massive, illegal clearcut logging on Sabah? It's time we call a spade a spade, and focus on where the most significant problems are. Until we do, and while we're studying and reporting on lesser problems, it's only going to get worse. Chuck |
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Post by papiliotheona on Jun 9, 2021 9:29:51 GMT -8
I get it, conservation is a bad thing. And then we wonder why collectors get a bad rap from the general public... John I don't recall a single big-name conservationist sticking up for citizen collecting and the priceless role it plays in world science--and can think of tons of instances of the opposite. I can't believe all these experts "don't know better"--they are making a stand for their preferred ideology. |
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Post by papiliotheona on Jun 9, 2021 9:39:28 GMT -8
I get it, conservation is a bad thing. And then we wonder why collectors get a bad rap from the general public... John For the life of me, I cannot fathom how here, a forum inundated with the scientifically minded, there prevails tendencies to over-react and twist others' posts to infer some far-reaching point. That's why I hate Twitter- everyone just has to post something, and half the time it's fraudulent, intentional manipulation of a prior statement. One would hope we'd be above that, but time and time again, it's been disproven. Not to harp a point, but show me where I said conservation is a bad thing. Perhaps I misread my own post (and some are a bit tongue in cheek) however, arguably all would be effective- in fact, more effective than what is being done now, by and large. Not to discredit those who do what they can. The fact remains though that a bounty on politicians forcing logging in the Brazilian rainforest would be far more effective than waggling on about the rare papilio we know are there. And, if you want to save pangolins, three conventional Tomahawks into personal compounds in China and/or Malaysia would work wonders. The fact is that deforestation is the #1 threat vector to most wildlife, including Papilio. Yet somehow, nobody cares, and no government is willing to do anything about it. The general public is enamoured with hit pieces in NatGeo that tug on their heartstrings, but doesn't care about deforestation so long as they get their palm oil and cheap lumber. Some of the cited papers probably are valid, and useful. However, some are narrow-minded, like worrying about a cut when you're having a heart attack. Global warming harming a birdwing on Kinabalu? How about the massive, illegal clearcut logging on Sabah? It's time we call a spade a spade, and focus on where the most significant problems are. Until we do, and while we're studying and reporting on lesser problems, it's only going to get worse. Chuck A thousand "amens" to that, Chuck. I am sick and tired of the official state religion of the day--PCism, and its close cousins of critical race theory and environmentalist hypocrisy. The last time I checked, it wasn't white Westerners clear-cutting the rainforests in tropical countries for oil palm plantations, cattle fields, or the international lumber market. I refuse to consider myself the R-word ("racist"--which apparently in 2021 is worse than being a serial killer or rapist or pedophile) because I think it's the epitome of selfishness for people who can't afford to feed themselves without destroying the world around them to continue to breed (outside of carrying capacity). The Western left screams and hollers about the (relatively trivial compared to narcotics, etc.) international trade in prized butterfly species (whether or not they are threatened even remotely) and refuses to say one single cross word about the leadership of Indonesia, Brazil, China, etc. You get canceled if you do in fact. Screw that. We are supposed to be real men here and capable of calling a spade a spade. |
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Post by exoticimports on Jun 9, 2021 10:18:46 GMT -8
I get it, conservation is a bad thing. And then we wonder why collectors get a bad rap from the general public... John I don't recall a single big-name conservationist sticking up for citizen collecting and the priceless role it plays in world science--and can think of tons of instances of the opposite. I can't believe all these experts "don't know better"--they are making a stand for their preferred ideology. Tom Emmel (RIP) was a proponent of amateur entomologists. If it didn't come out in words all the time, he showed it in his actions by arranging numerous trips overseas. But you are right, in general. There is a pecking order, and amateurs are generally not invited to the party. Their donations are freely accepted, but they aren't part of the crowd. Case in point, when I grew tired of the regulatory rubbish I asked several name brand museums for an affiliation; not one provided, despite each having gladly taken many donated specimens worth thousands of dollars. There are, of course, two sides to every coin. First, that's how the professionals feed their families; if an amateur is out doing "their" work, that's less opportunity for them. Second, having been in groups of entomologists, some of whom had barely been out of home country, the neophytes are more trouble than they are worth. One can, of course, establish some level of credentials. Join Lep Soc. Attend the meetings. Go get your own grant. Pay your own way. As I've said, nothing in USA is forbidden (same goes for most countries), it only requires licenses, and that's only money. |
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Post by exoticimports on Jun 9, 2021 10:40:20 GMT -8
it wasn't white Westerners clear-cutting the rainforests in tropical countries for oil palm plantations, cattle fields, or the international lumber market. To be transparent and open on all issues, the oil plantations, cattle fields, and lumber exist largely to provide for "white men"- Americans, Europeans, and European-descent foreign markets in other countries. That has changed, but only recently, to include the Chinese, some rich Africans and rich Asians. The foreign leadership and even the villagers are only responding to a market economy- a Western market economy. Trade trees for outboards. We do the same in USA. Scientific papers that jump on the trendy PC bandwagon serve two purposes: first, to gain clout amongst a strong, and growing stronger, group. Second, and related, to ensure the author recognition and revenue. So he can buy lumber and an outboard too. And, in being PC, oft-antisocial scientists gain friends. In fact, I'm surprised we don't see more papers like these from Coleopterists  The biggest problem is that the environmental (mis)management, like almost everything else, is a racket. A revenue racket. The US president can put the brakes on drugs, pollution, and ecological destruction in Brazil by lifting the phone and calling INDOPACOM. Or, a bit slower, he could leverage trade to do the same thing. But nothing happens. Status quo wins. Truly, the smart person jumps on the bandwagon. You've got 80 years here, might as well enjoy it. It's our descendants that will suffer, but oh well. Chuck |
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Post by Adam Cotton on Jun 18, 2021 10:38:47 GMT -8
I have just received the following information from the Swallowtail and Birdwing Butterfly Trust, who have made the presentations from the Conference available on YouTube: "Saving Swallowtails" Did you miss the Conference? Want to watch both sections? We have loaded them onto YouTube for you! Simply click here to view www.youtube.com/channel/UCdB29sTt1KFJPc76X2PfEjg/playlists |
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