|
|
Post by exoticimports on Oct 27, 2020 8:42:58 GMT -8
Beyond that, there are a number of online entities that publish scientific papers, often to the chagrin of established hardcopy publishers; last I knew the latter did not want to recognize research (e.g., newly described species) that were published online (e.g., Zootaxa). I wonder if this has changed. Chuck Zootaxa papers are available online, but they also provide printed copies to a specified number of libraries to comply with the ICZN Code requirements for publications. Many online only journals also completely comply with the 2012 amendment to the ICZN Code, so that even though they only publish electronically without any paper copies they are also Code compliant and all nomentlatural acts in their papers are validly published. No-one can unilaterally refuse to accept publications which comply with the ICZN Code, whether in paper or electronic form. Adam. Good to know. My most recent experience is a decade ago when a colleague got tired of waiting for a "name brand" publication to publish a new description, and when he went with ZooTaxa there was "criticism" that ZooTaxa wasn't valid. I'm presuming that most or all of the scientific community has come on board. I need to find a list of publications that comply with ICZN code; I was reading a paper (by an acknowledged expert) last week in an online publication and was surprised that the publication/paper subject matters struck me as out of alignment. But perhaps it's another case of tiring of the wait, or making a statement about the "name brand" publications, I don't know and didn't ask. Chuck |
|
|
|
Post by bobw on Oct 27, 2020 15:35:52 GMT -8
I've published my last couple of papers in Zootaxa and reviewed a few by other authors for them. It's considered a reputable online journal and everything published in it is valid, I certainly wouldn't use them if it wasn't.
|
|
|
|
Post by wingedwishes on Oct 27, 2020 19:30:48 GMT -8
With my collecting I was planning on recording a very large amount of data. I would have data for specimens not usually recorded but I believe very valuable for research although not under an institutional permit. For example - Each would have GPS, time of day, temp, humidity.... May have more like elevation, wind, condition of location (disturbed forest, rocky, river etc).
Though I sell, I teach groups for about 5 hours a week on conservation and restoration. My own time. This is one thing I love to do now that I am retired.
|
|
|
|
Post by exoticimports on Nov 3, 2020 5:42:43 GMT -8
With complete coincidence, I stumbled across an ATL NOTES issue dated March/ June 2005. A lengthy discourse by J. B. Heppner is titled "Internet Publications?"
Two quotes from the article:
"One new site, the 'so-called' 'journal' titled Zootaxa..."
"All internet postings of new names should be invalid even if within the current Code."
|
|
|
|
Post by Adam Cotton on Nov 3, 2020 7:06:14 GMT -8
With complete coincidence, I stumbled across an ATL NOTES issue dated March/ June 2005. A lengthy discourse by J. B. Heppner is titled "Internet Publications?" Two quotes from the article: "One new site, the 'so-called' 'journal' titled Zootaxa..." "All internet postings of new names should be invalid even if within the current Code." Until 2012 all e-only journals were not ICZN Code compliant and any new names or other nomenclatural acts in them (lectotype designations etc etc) were not validly pubblished under the Code and thus not recognised. Strict requirements for e-only publication were implemented in the Code amendment I mentioned above, and names and other nomenclatural acts that do not comply with the amendment are unavailable under the Code. See www.iczn.org/the-code/electronic-publication-made-available-with-amendment-to-the-code/ for details of the amendment. Obviously John Heppner was not aware in 2005 that Zootaxa has always published paper copies of each work to ensure that the works are Code compliant. Certainly names 'published' on webpages are unavailable under the Code, and similarly if someone proposed a new name on Insectnet it would have no validity whatsoever. I should add that there is an important distinction between nomenclature and taxonomy. There is no Code governing taxonomic publication, and if someone posted on Insectnet that "a is a synonym of b" that would be regarded as a taxonomic opinion, although it would be normal for such information to be published in a publication, even if completely electronic and not compliant with the ICZN Code. Adam. |
|
|
|
Post by wingedwishes on Nov 4, 2020 19:29:39 GMT -8
I contacted Pooks Hill that John suggested and asked about non research permits (that is commercial) and got this response:
Hi Tyson,
The forestry department only has forms for permits if you are doing research but they suggested to me that you could collect from a Butterfly farm.
I have spoken to Robin Greaves of Green Hills Butterfly Farm and he is happy for you to collect there. They are not too far from us.
We would be pleased if you still wanted to stay at Pook's Hill (Green Hill's doesn't have accommodation). We would be happy to put our light on in the evenings.
If you would like any further information, do let us know.
with regards,
Vicki
I think I'd need some document from the forestry department when returning to the USA???
|
|
|
|
Post by kevinkk on Nov 4, 2020 19:46:19 GMT -8
I voted, just for fun I suppose. If I go out of the country, it's going to be after another death in the family, and I can wait for that.
Some of us can't travel because of other obligations.
I'm envious, of the variety, and the experiences.
When and if I get out of the USA, it'll be researched and somewhere I'm comfortable with.
One time, at 16, I went with an entomology tour to the Dominican Republic, it was itinerary specific, but I and a number of others
opted to stay at the original lodge location in the mountains, what I did discover, is that you can make it on your own, at least
in the 80's, I'm sure a guide would be helpful now, as well as doing research on everything. Meaning everything. I'd prefer to not be
kidnapped, my brother probably wouldn't pay a ransom.He likes me fine, but hey.
|
|
|
|
Post by Paul K on Nov 4, 2020 19:49:47 GMT -8
If one collect without permit which is required for collecting, it will not be possible to export specimens out of the country.
What would you say on airport? I just collected on Robins farm.
Customs won’t buy it at least I think they won’t. I suppose if you could ask for export permit or at least get some document from forestry .
|
|
|
|
Post by wingedwishes on Nov 4, 2020 20:16:16 GMT -8
If one collect without permit which is required for collecting, it will not be possible to export specimens out of the country. What would you say on airport? I just collected on Robins farm. Customs won’t buy it at least I think they won’t. I suppose if you could ask for export permit or at least get some document from forestry . Yup- 'they stated'is never acceptable. Well,waiting for more data. |
|
|
|
Post by jshuey on Nov 5, 2020 6:03:15 GMT -8
I contacted Pooks Hill that John suggested and asked about non research permits (that is commercial) and got this response: Hi Tyson, The forestry department only has forms for permits if you are doing research but they suggested to me that you could collect from a Butterfly farm. I have spoken to Robin Greaves of Green Hills Butterfly Farm and he is happy for you to collect there. They are not too far from us. We would be pleased if you still wanted to stay at Pook's Hill (Green Hill's doesn't have accommodation). We would be happy to put our light on in the evenings. If you would like any further information, do let us know. with regards, Vicki I think I'd need some document from the forestry department when returning to the USA??? So, I've never used Pooks Hill to obtain a permit - but they supported Mathew Barnes' permits for years to collect moths at the site. Why do not propose to do some "research" and update his findings? (see www.mbarnes.force9.co.uk/belizemoths/belizehome.htm). If they go for that, then you have a permit. Once you have a permit, you are good to go coming back into the US as long as your permit covers the major insect orders you intend to collect. Green Hill is Jan Meerman's old place. He sold it and moved to Belomopan a couple years ago. I think the new owner is exporting pupae plus running the local butterfly house. When Jan had it, it was amaizing. You have never seen so many Caligo and Morpho in one place before! john |
|
|
|
Post by wingedwishes on Nov 5, 2020 11:50:40 GMT -8
John,
Good data indeed.
A product of my collecting would produce photos and cataloging of species found with location etc.
I think I should ask Mr. Barnes if he would accept detailed data and photographs for supplementing his research site.
I've already written to Green Hill and am awaiting a reply.
Cheers,
Tyson
|
|
|
|
Post by wingedwishes on Nov 5, 2020 12:13:01 GMT -8
Ok, sent a message to Mr. Barnes. His website is good. I think I can expand data there by a large amount.
|
|
|
|
Post by wingedwishes on Nov 10, 2020 14:22:08 GMT -8
I am very sure I'm going to Belize. I spoke with Robin Greaves at Green Hills Ranch and sine he has the permits there and in America, he will send them on to me from his home in Texas. Problem solved. Looks like he can save and sell specimens prior to my arrival. He has night collecting equipment too! Looks like June will be our expedition.
Tyson
|
|
|
|
Post by coloradeo on Nov 10, 2020 18:22:22 GMT -8
Wow, sounds awesome. Thanks for playing this out on the boards so we can learn from your experience in setting this up -- and John's experience doing this over the years. Appreciate you both and the other folks who chimed in. Can't wait to see how it all turns out. Would be a Top 5 item for me someday too.
Eric
|
|
|
|
Post by exoticimports on Nov 10, 2020 19:06:03 GMT -8
Bring a photo of Jshuey as a talisman to hang around your neck.
Belize isn’t what it was, but that’s a people issue, I don’t think the bugs care.
|
|
|
|
Post by wingedwishes on Nov 10, 2020 20:13:00 GMT -8
Going to be a long 6 months.We will go in June of 2021.
Mikes Place Belize was recommended as a place to stay/sleep and the price looks good.
So far the 3 largest costs will be (rounded up)
1. Round trip for me and daughter -$ 900
2. 14 day room rental at Mikes - $ 700
3. Lep purchases..? High guess $3,000
smaller costs
Food etc...$1,000
Transportation may be paid for shuttling rather than renting. Not decided yet.
Of course there will be massive photos and videos.
|
|
|
|
Post by wingedwishes on Nov 10, 2020 20:16:49 GMT -8
Bring a photo of Jshuey as a talisman to hang around your neck. Belize isn’t what it was, but that’s a people issue, I don’t think the bugs care. Between Mike and Robin we will be safe and have a work around for legal export. |
|
