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Post by andresheleno on Apr 29, 2020 14:15:16 GMT -8
I m a colector and buy many specimens in A2 or A - quality, is the only whay to get some rare specimens, but i see a few colections from other colectors and they only whant A1 quality. I think A2 specimens have also scientific value.
I realy don t know why many colectors don t whant specimens in A2 quality?
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Post by Paul K on Apr 29, 2020 15:25:02 GMT -8
I m a colector and buy many specimens in A2 or A - quality, is the only whay to get some rare specimens, but i see a few colections from other colectors and they only whant A1 quality. I think A2 specimens have also scientific value. I realy don t know why many colectors don t whant specimens in A2 quality? Yes, of course even Z10- ( ex car windshield/grill ) specimens have scientific value as long as they have correct data and can be distinguished one from another 🙄 Many collectors don’t collect insects for science but strictly for pleasure of viewing and admiring their beauty, thus they want A1. Also I found out that A2 specimens for sale are harder to find as sellers don’t want to bother with those. |
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Post by andresheleno on Apr 29, 2020 15:45:12 GMT -8
Thanks, it is true, many sellers don t offer A2 specimens, i think they prefere recieve the top profit. I already buy specimens A2 for 20€ on auction that in A1 quality take value of 130€ or more,
if i can t give that value, i prefere get a specimen A2 than have none.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2020 18:16:01 GMT -8
For many of us collectors, the first caught of a rare specimen is A2. After I caught my first of a rare or even new species for the collection, I rarely caught more as, with luck, better specimens showed up. One great way that collectors use A2 specimens is for rearing. So many leps through the years were no good quality wise, but they laid ova for me to start a batch of what would become awesome A1 specimens. In most cases, if not all, I still have that first beater specimen of a good bug. I’ve reared tons of S. diana, but I still have my first male and female that I came across years ago. And....be it known.....some of my most special prizes caught are only in the collection as A2 and I don’t mind a bit. For me, the thrill of coming across a rare bug is what counts the most even if it’s not A1.
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Post by jhyatt on Apr 30, 2020 6:40:57 GMT -8
Andre, I'm with you! I have no problem whatsoever with A2 specimens. If I catch an absolutely perfect one, great - but if it's not perfect and I want it, I'm delighted to keep it. I
guess I'm strictly a scientific collector, as opposed to being an aesthetic collector. A 2nd qual bug with good full data pleases me a lot more than a 1A with sketchy data.
I actually try to avoid getting reared material, especially of exotics. They're like those odd hybrids that people make, but which don't occur in nature. Either way, it'd seem
like collecting farm animals, not "real" wild butterflies and moths, to me!
My wife once said I have a collection of beautiful, amazingly exotic labels with scraps of butterflies attached.
Cheers,
jh
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leptraps
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Post by leptraps on Apr 30, 2020 7:02:59 GMT -8
I only collect North American material. However, some of my most prized specimens are "Beaters". I still have my very first Speyeria diana (female) that I collected on Labor Day weekend 1968 in the Smokey Mountains. A true "Rag"...
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Post by bobw on Apr 30, 2020 10:12:19 GMT -8
Obviously it's nice to have perfect specimens but to me it's not that important, the most important thing is to have a series of specimens with accurate data. A2 grade can cover a multitude of sins and obviously it's much better to have fresh specimens with wing damage then ones where the wings may be intact but they're old and flown so the features are not so discernible.
When I'm buying material I actively seek out A2 material as I can often get a series of 3 or 4 A" pairs for the same price as a single A1 pair, that gives me a small series that I need for a reasonable price. A series of both sexes is important in order to show the variation within a population.
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Post by drewalan2 on Apr 30, 2020 10:28:31 GMT -8
I'm a beetle guy, so my needs are quite a bit different than those of you who collect leps in that you need good wings, which easily are damaged. For beetles, not really an issue. They don't need all their legs, or both antennae, to be useful. As all of you pointed out, good data are the essential thing.
When I purchase beetles, I do so to get taxa I need to fill in large gaps where I need comparative material. I'm very happy with A2, and seek them out because, as previously pointed out, I can get a lot more bang for my buck.
Just my 2-cents worth while bored at work.....
Drew
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Post by 58chevy on Apr 30, 2020 12:57:59 GMT -8
My first luna moth was captured by my grandfather (at the insistence of my grandmother) at a train station long ago. I was about 10 years old, and that was the "holy grail" of moths for me at the time. Despite being heavily damaged by rough handling during the capture, I was extremely excited to get the specimen. I still have it in my collection, and it brings back fond memories of my grandparents whenever I look at it. The missing tails and worn-off scales tell a story that an A1 specimen could never tell.
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Post by joachim on Apr 30, 2020 13:54:36 GMT -8
Andre, it is true what Paul and others say. The definition A1, A2 and B2 , B52 ( great rock band ) are from the time speciemens were offered with type writer made prices lists.
today, just make a photo and send it.
Yes I have bought some A1 speciemens just for admiring them but I also have a box with very much damaged ones and I have a look at them and also memories how I got them, buying, crashed by customs with their dirty fingers or just cheaper.
When a A1 specimen ( Caught so not always such A1 as bred ) was 100, then a little worn was 90, A2 was 40 or 50, and a really bad one was 15, 20 $
So what do you do if you don´t have much money? 15 $ and you have one. ( sometimes you get a B52 for free )
If you look at some museums, they have Ornithoptera shot with a gun as the people who were on an island for getting food and fresh water for a day or two. So there is still the scientific value and a great story. Seems most of the catchers even didn´t reached their home because of scurvy and other illness. What a story!
I also bought sometimes a lot of 100 specimens, I have a lot of fun preparing them. What to you expect 100 Sphingids caught at light?
So keep on, stay healthy,
Joachim
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Post by andresheleno on Apr 30, 2020 15:53:55 GMT -8
If you have see the book for example Butterflyes of the World, you can see there thousands of species, i think is impossible to get all, some species you have to get them in low quality, because there are many colectors, and if you have money there are always other colectors that have more money.
An A2 or A- quality in some species for me is good.
There are colectors who only colect one family, that whay is more easy to get all A1, but if you colect all familyes is more dificoult.
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Post by Paul K on Apr 30, 2020 16:59:34 GMT -8
I’m afraid you are right, it is impossible to collect all species of butterflies and if you add moths which are equally beautiful and interesting to study you are looking about 150 000!
I personally don’t focus on specific family, I collect all Lepidoptera but I don’t buy specimens, only very rarely.
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Post by andresheleno on Apr 30, 2020 22:43:55 GMT -8
Paul you have to live in an area were are many species, because you only colect specimens that were catch buy you, and since you don t buy species, you have to travel a lot, for me this year to colect only the Anthocharis euphenoides i have to travel more than 400km in the noth, and i take the risk not to catch nothing.
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Post by Paul K on May 1, 2020 6:12:00 GMT -8
Paul you have to live in an area were are many species, because you only colect specimens that were catch buy you, and since you don t buy species, you have to travel a lot, Andre, neither of one above. I just rather have fewer species searched by me in the field than have thousands purchased examples. |
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Post by jshuey on May 1, 2020 6:29:47 GMT -8
I m a colector and buy many specimens in A2 or A - quality, is the only whay to get some rare specimens, but i see a few colections from other colectors and they only whant A1 quality. I think A2 specimens have also scientific value. I realy don t know why many colectors don t whant specimens in A2 quality? I don't know what families or geography you are interested in. But for me (Neotropical Hesperiidae) my best results have been with "commissioning" local collectors to provide bulk samples (with data) of unidentified species. You don't pay much per specimen, which is good because about half are common widespread species and quality jumps around between A1 to B2. But you end up with some really rare bugs if your collector is any good. If you are trying to purchase individual identified species, you are stuck with the A1 dealers, because that is what the demand from their suppliers. john |
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