ckswank
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Posts: 239
Country: USA
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Post by ckswank on Jun 13, 2011 12:21:12 GMT -8
wollastoni -
Thanks for the tip with the sticky bands. I'll have to try that.
Charlie
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2011 16:40:54 GMT -8
Fortunately I have had none of those visitors yet.....
But, in my 'prevent-madness', I do have 6 Ultra-sonic repellors on all the time in the center of my cieling facing in all directions downward at 45 degree angles. That room must be one large amount of sound---thank G I can't hear all that noise. Coupled with a dehumidier for just that room and my Cedar Oil, I've been lucky.
Speaking of Cedar Oil, all is going well, but I did do my once-every-five year treatment of vapona(small cubes on pins in the drawers for several months). Soon the Vapona will be out and the Cedar Oil alone will deter invaders. I just get that 'be sure all is killed feeling' once in a while and have to reinforce the Cedar Oil.
I am in the process of making a heat chamber to put mounted material into prior to putting them in the drawers. I'm planning on using a light bulb with metal can w balsa to pin on-----with a therm., put the specimen in for a couple of hours or even one hour and anything living (dermestids etc.) will die. I really fear introducing dermestids from purchased or stored material. I'm going to test this out with some unimportant stuff to check for wing curling and the like. I have used Acetone for this, but would prefer to avoid using it if possible and freezing is not my first choice.
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Post by Khalid Fadil on Jun 13, 2011 18:04:02 GMT -8
Not exactly a "whole building", just a large room on the back of the garage. My aircon bills aren't so bad, because the room is well insulated and has no windows. Airtight boxes with regularly dehdrated silica-gel should be ok for a few years, but it just takes one catastrophic event to destroy a whole collection (I feel a shudder every time I see pics on TV of floods, earthquakes or tornados destroying houses). Adam. Yes... The loss of your collection would be a great one...
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Post by Khalid Fadil on Jun 13, 2011 18:06:07 GMT -8
Adam - I know what you mean about the natural disasters. Makes me cringe all summer long watching the Gulf of Mexico. Went through Hurricane Ike unscathed almost three years ago. My biggest concern are the damned imported fire ants we have. They come in the house occasionally through the weep holes around the foundation. If there is anything around for them to eat, they will be all over it in no time. I went collecting in SE AZ two years ago & didn't catch much because the monsoon season was very dry that year & had not received much rain. What little I did catch, I had on 3 or 4 spreading boards on a drying rack. The fire ants came in without me realizing it and within one day I was left with a few wings! Talk about being PO! At least so far, they haven't figured out how to get into my boxes of specimens! Just thought I would share my experience. Charlie I had that problem too for a while... Although, mine were red ants. Still annoying nonetheless.
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Post by Khalid Fadil on Jun 13, 2011 18:08:39 GMT -8
About ants, a friend of mine in Indonesia puts sticky bands on the sides of his spreading boards to prevent ants to climb on it and destroy the leps... True that they can destroy a lep very fastly... STICKY BANDS... I never thought of that...
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Post by Khalid Fadil on Jun 13, 2011 18:09:58 GMT -8
I don't have a problem with ants thank goodness, but I have known Earwigs to find a specimen on the board and eat it. Dave Earwigs...?
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Post by nomihoudai on Jun 13, 2011 21:32:58 GMT -8
A heat chamber for killing off stuff ? You want to cook them at 200°C ? ^^ I would rather fear that this could destroy the colors in the specimen. If your heat chamber ist just going up to 50°C then I think you can safe time and not vuilt it because that shouldn't harm the critters too much. When you heat them up their metabolism will run a "little" faster but they should make it,... when you freeze them that is a different story, their cells will freeze and burst appart, that's how you kill them. Every museum I know off uses freezers to kill off any speimen before putting into their collection and if heat chamber would be easier I guess they would have done that.
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Post by saturniidave on Jun 14, 2011 10:04:15 GMT -8
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2011 18:58:56 GMT -8
nomihoudai, No I don't intend to cook them--certainly not at 200C which is 392F I was thinking in the mid hundreds around 140-150F. With all due respect, many of the best practices for insect curation are not done by museums. Heck, many museums are underfunded and let their stuff go to H#$%. Museums surely don't use Cedar Oil, yet I've known museum staff to suffer from liver cancer from all the PDB or Napthaline exposure. I know three collectors who are now using Cedar Oil even if the museums don't. My point here is to explore different methods regardless of what museums do. I'm sure they don't use convectional heating racks to dry specimens or inject specimens with Gin to get that truly softened-like-fresh quality prior to mounting. I could go on...... Museums need not be the standard from which our hobby is based. I stated that I am investigating/making up a trial chamber for this purpose. Maybe it will work and maybe it won't. btw---most organisms do expire when exposed to heat in the 150s....proof.....that is the recommended temp. for meat preparation(safe to consume when cooked to that temp.).
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Post by wollastoni on Jun 14, 2011 23:09:25 GMT -8
Bill,
Did you try Gin injection ? Does it works better than hot water ? I would be interested to try if you think it is better.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2011 5:25:13 GMT -8
Oliver,
I have been using Gin for many years and it works SO well. I've even injected perfectly dried specimens and mounted them a minutes later. I usually...now... soften the specimen in my chamber and use Gin to get any remaining stiffness out. When I want to re-do an anteanna w/o softening the whole specimen, simple....take a delicate paint brush and 'paint' it onto the antenna several times in a few minutes.
I've heard that hot water can mess up some of the fatty insides/structure and I am very concerned not to ever make water marks/stains on the wings should any water come through the body somehow. Using Gin, I have the benefit of a quick softening ....AND.... it dries very quickly. I dare say that Gin even speeds up the drying process after being set on the board.
When I inject, I usually enter in the front just under the head, then I 'paint' the outside of the underside of the wing where the vein meets the thorax, then wait a few minutes. I put enough in to where it starts to ooze out the spiracles. After a few minutes, it either is ready to go, or needs a further injection/'painting'. I have used Gin many times on those tough to get flexible saturniids, nymphalids, and even the ornithoptera.
Try it, you'll like it. Of course there are others out there who have different opinions. I am merely stating what I think of Gin as an assist to softening prep./mounting.
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Post by dertodesking on Jun 15, 2011 11:22:44 GMT -8
Bill,
I've used the "gin technique" a number of times now since I first read your description back on the old forum. I've also found it especially useful not just for stiff lepidoptera but also loosening up the jaws on some rock solid lucanids.
I wonder if other booze would work? Also, I wonder what it is about gin in particular (if it is just gin or if any spirit would work?) that has this effect?
Simon
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2011 13:05:12 GMT -8
Simon,
I don't know abut other booze. Since the Gin thing has worked so well for me, I don't have the ambition to try other types. Yes, I forgot that loosening jaws/legs of coleops is another use for Gin. Letting it seep into the cracks/joints does great. Thanks for mentioning it.
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Post by wollastoni on Jun 15, 2011 23:41:55 GMT -8
Bill < very interesting. Does it work if you inject in the bottom of the thorax (like in the classic "hot water" technique) ? I will definitely try this. Hot water technique sometimes stains butterflies, especially for Pieridae I collect.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2011 7:33:48 GMT -8
Oliver,
Yes, it works if injected through the thorax between the legs, but I've come to find the ventral head approach does a slightly better/faster job. I also would hate to accidentally inject through the thorax where the needle actually goes through the top and the Gin gets on the wings. The few times this has happened, I've been lucky---no stains, but I am not willing to risk it. And, I have never (admittedly) tried injecting a very small lep.
I'd suggest you experiment with a few 'extras' and find the approach that works best for you. Don't try this first on a special specimen. I've coime to be a fanatic when it comes to a specimen being truly ready for mounting. I avoid at all costs the bent veins, broken off wings, and the like. If, after some 6 hours in the gently heated container, it does not produce a specimen nearly as though fresh, then I surely use the Gin. I did, but gave it up, the injecting of Gin into a perfectly dry specimen...it does work, but I prefer the two-pronged approach.
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