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Post by nightwings on Aug 21, 2018 14:22:27 GMT -8
This was a very interesting and informative thread. I am planning on refurbishing some of my collection and needed all of that helpful feedback. So I am looking for better paper and considering (maybe) getting a laser printer, as all I have are all purpose ink jet types now. But first, the big question is whether there are any OSX label programs available for MacBookPros?
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Post by nightwings on Aug 25, 2018 6:43:59 GMT -8
I finally did another search on this site, and true to my memory I found the program with tabs for different labels that I remembered from 2012 (yes, I have been a member since before then). Unfortunately, it will download but not function on my MacBookPro. There are three great threads on labels on this site. So, still looking for a way to make new labels.
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Post by Paul K on Aug 25, 2018 10:39:54 GMT -8
I finally did another search on this site, and true to my memory I found the program with tabs for different labels that I remembered from 2012 (yes, I have been a member since before then). Unfortunately, it will download but not function on my MacBookPro. There are three great threads on labels on this site. So, still looking for a way to make new labels. I run Windows on my MacBook Air, very helpful as some programs not exist for MacOS. You would need to install parallel program or other to let you install windows on Mac. Paul
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Post by nightwings on Aug 25, 2018 11:36:15 GMT -8
thanks for the feedback Paul. I'll see if I can get Windows for my Macbook Pro
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Post by Paul K on Aug 29, 2018 7:24:05 GMT -8
I just purchased HP 200g (52 lb.) glossy brochure paper (Q6608A) And the labels look great with one exception, the powder is not baking into the paper and can be peeled off with a finger nail. When touched I can clearly feel the printing, it is not smooth. I understand that we don’t really touch or scrap the labels but I am afraid that the printing can come off the paper in long run.
Now I have ordered the same paper but matte finish Q8824A and I will test it if the powder will actually get baked in. I will follow up with results once I get it.
For now I am using also HP paper which is bright white and powder is baked in properly but it is only 32lb a bit too thin I suppose.
Paul
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Post by alandmor on Aug 29, 2018 7:34:02 GMT -8
It is a color laser printer? Check your printer settings. Should have settings that you can change based on paper type, print quality, bonding temperature etc. that may give better results. Haven't noticed that with the HP glossy labels I did but can't say I checked either.
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Post by Paul K on Aug 29, 2018 7:53:46 GMT -8
It is a color laser printer? Check your printer settings. Should have settings that you can change based on paper type, print quality, bonding temperature etc. that may give better results. Haven't noticed that with the HP glossy labels I did but can't say I checked either. It is black laser printer. Very basic, Samsung xpress M2020W. I don’t think it can be set for different options.
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Post by jshuey on Aug 30, 2018 5:10:17 GMT -8
I've seen laser-print flake off high-gloss paper. Why would you risk the integrity of your collection over the aesthetics of your labels? Melted powder (the ink in a laser printer) needs something to grip onto. It's not like real ink that soaks into the paper. The glossier the paper, the fewer microscopic surface irregularities there are for the laser-ink to bond to.
And 52lb paper??? Do you drill a hole in the paper before you insert the pin? Or use a hammer? I'm being a bit sarcastic - because I use only #2 pins - and punching a hole through 52lb paper seems like you could bend an occasional pin. #1 pin would be nearly impossible to use - right?
And 3.5 point font??? Jeeze - you'd better give up your collection before you hit 50 years old! As an "old guy" who has 20-20 vision, but needs 1x reading glasses at close range, I'd have to use at least 3X glasses (or binoculars) to scan these labels! I can get all the data I need on a five-line 6pt Arial Narrow font set at exactly 6pt line spacing. I use Arial Narrow because it is a very simple font that that seems perfectly designed to print clearly at small point sizes.
John
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Post by Paul K on Aug 30, 2018 18:42:56 GMT -8
So, my paper arrived today and I tested it. It is HP brochure matte paper 52lb ( 200g) Q8824A. The powder sticks on pretty good I would say same as on 32lb and it is about the same bright white. I will be using this paper for all families accept Lycaenidae which are pinned on pins #00,0,1 and it will be impossible to push pin through 52lb.
Paul
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leptraps
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Post by leptraps on Sept 1, 2018 4:09:21 GMT -8
After reading John Shuey's issues with labels printed with an Laser Jet Printer, I became seriously concerned. Over 60% of the specimens in my collection, the specimen data label and ID label were printed with a Laser Jet Printer.
I use Canon Laser Jet Printers. I have used Canon Printers for the paper size, 11X17, which I use to print Newsletters (Former Newsletter Editor for the Southern Lepidopterist Society and currently the Society of Kentucky Lepidopterists.) I have never considered the longevity of the print on the label.
I began using Laser Jets in the late 1980's or early 1990's. It is the only type printer I have used. I went into my collection and I found labels from 1989. I removed one of the labels from the specimen, made a replacement label and put the the specimen back into the collection.
With and Exacto Knife I attempted the scrap off the print. I did not come off easily. And, the print appeared to have imbeded the paper.
I googled "Longevity of Laser Jet Print" and got a mixed bag of responses. I went straight to the horses mouth. IBM made printers in Lexington, Kentucky, just down the road from Georgetown. IBM sold off the printer bussiness unit and it became Lexmark, A friend of mine who is also a member of the church I attend is a retired engineer from Lexmark. I met him for lunch yesterday and I ask him the question about the longevity of Laser Jet Print. His response was rather simple. Use print carteridges made by or for the printer manufacture, it will last as long as the paper it is printed upon. However, if you purchase knock-off brands or store brands, you could have issues with Longevity.
I also learned the Laser Jet process from him and that was a lengthy explanation because of the interconnections between the printer, ink carteridges, computer and programs for both printer and the information to be printed. I ate my lunch (We went to a Waffle House for lunch of course.), drank several cups of coffee and he was still going strong. To make it short, Laser Jet Printing in general is "Branding the Paper".
When I thought he had finished his explanation, he asked a question. What type of paper are you printing on. I brought a piece of the paper I use. International Paper Corp: Accent Opaque Digital (Cover Smooth) 65lb White. (Card Stock). His comment: That is like printing on papyrus. That will be around forever.
The only thing better would be the equivalent of Tattooing.
I was satisfied with the answers.
I bet that 65lb paper rattled John Shuey's cage. I only use #2 Black Enameled Insect pins. I have never had a problem pushing it thru the 65lb card stock.
Also, I use the same paper to cover the wings when I mount specimens.
I am okay with my printer, paper and Laser Jet Ink.
What do you think John Shuey? I must admit, I never considered the longevity of the printing. However, I am still concerned.
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leptraps
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Post by leptraps on Sept 1, 2018 4:13:55 GMT -8
I also forgot to mention that I use Ariel #4 on Collection Data labels and Ariel #5 on ID labels. And at 73 years of age, I have no problem reading them.
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Post by leptraps on Sept 1, 2018 4:47:34 GMT -8
I re-read John Shuey's comments. Especially labelling information. At one time I included habitat info. I also included such things as nectar source (If I collected a butterfly nectaring I would ID the plant and include the info on the labels. I do not know why, but I stopped for some reason, probably 30+ years ago.
When I painted Catocala bait on trees, I recorded the species of the tree on the label. For many years when I collected specimens in a Bait Trap, I included a small label the simply said "Bait Trap". I stopped doing that many years ago.
However, after reading John Shuey's comments, I think he is absolutely correct. The more information on the labels ads scientific value to the specimens.
Never to old to make changes.
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Post by jshuey on Sept 1, 2018 6:02:36 GMT -8
After reading What do you think John Shuey? I must admit, I never considered the longevity of the printing. However, I am still concerned. Hi Leroy, So - here how I came to my worries. Years before laser printing - like in the 80's, you had Xerox Machines that use basically the same ink principal. Electrostatic charges cause dust to form patterns on paper, and then it gets melted into place. Before computers could do it, Xeroxes could reduce print size. So I would print out a bunch of data labels and then reduce them a couple of times on the Xerox. At the time, my wife was working on a fine art degree, and since we were at art supply stores all the time, I'd buy sheets of ~40lb high-gloss Bristol Board. I could cut this down and run it through a xerox printer. It was the best acid free paper you could get at the time. I quickly noticed that with this combo, the xerox printing did not adhere well to the Bristol board. If you flexed the paper, parts of the letters literally pealed free from the paper. We'll I happened to work at the place that commercialized Xerography at the time (Battelle Memorial Institute), so I wandered over and asked some of the engineers who worked every day with the technology, and they told me it was all about really smooth paper surfaces. I should move to a matt finish and all would be fine. I did and that was that. So, I've stuck with matt finishes ever since. John
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Post by jhyatt on Sept 1, 2018 6:08:59 GMT -8
I'm with Leroy on this issue. I'm using Unisource "Colorsource Index", 110 lb basis weight, long grain paper. It has a very hard, shiny surface and holds ink from my HP laser B&W printer just fine. I have no problem getting my #2 and 3 pins through the 110 lb paper, but I do admit that if the store had any 65 lb version of the same paper, I'd buy it.
Previously I bought Riverside Paper Co.'s "Array Classic Card" stock, 65 lb, acid free paper. This paper has a non-shiny, textured surface - feels a bit rough to the fingers. I find that my laser printer ink will not adhere well to this paper. By the time I have cut a long strip of labels into singles, my thumb has smeared the ink on about 20% of them.
So basically my experience is the reverse of John Shuey's. I guess the lesson here is that the only way to choose a paper is to buy some and try it on your specific printer and ink. Nothing beats actual experiments.
Before switching to HP laser printers years ago, I used an ink-jet color printer. I abandoned it because my usage was pretty irregular and it constantly was drying out or fouling in some way - needed cleaning every time I wanted to print.
jh
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Post by leptraps on Sept 1, 2018 7:59:56 GMT -8
I need to back up a little bit. There is another story here I flat forgot about. When I first became editor of the Society of Kentucky Lepidopterists I began by using a huge HP 7500 Series printer B/W only. You could shove about any size paper including 11X17 into it. I used Word Perfect for the word processing program and included color photos. (It was the first Lepidopterist newsletter in color.)
I would fit in the photographs in a box, then delete the photographs. I would then print the B/W. I would then lock the boxes in place, delete the print. Ad the photographs into the blocks and print the finished newsletter with Color photographs on a Canon 1220 color Laser Jet.
I acquired the HP 7500 printers (I actually own two of them.) When a company I worked for was sold, I asked for the printers as they were no longer used. They let me have them.
For several years I printed my labels on one of those printer. It was a heat print process and When the printed paper came out, it was "hot". This AM, I found some of those printed labels and I could not scrape off the print. I even used some Ethyl Acetate and it would not damage or smear the print.
As for the labeling of others. While employed with The Interior Steel Equipment Co. of Cleveland, Ohio. We made museum storage cabinets. As a result I visited numerous museums with large holding of insects. Most of the labeling, both data and ID was very poor.
Just to emphasize John Shuey's data requirements, When I was 13 or 14 years of age, my Grandmother took me to the Smithsonian Museum in Washington, DC. There I met the late J.F.Gates Clark who taught me how to correctly mount and Label specimens. A prosses I still adhere to til this day.
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