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Post by wingedwishes on Sept 15, 2014 7:18:26 GMT -8
I'll just get buried with mine, a death bed of needles and mandibles... I wish I could see the paper an anthropologist writes when he exhumes your burial site 1,000 years from now!
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Post by Adam Cotton on Sept 15, 2014 13:00:16 GMT -8
and holotypes have to be stored in museums on submission of papers. Actually Holotypes don't HAVE "to be stored in museums on submission of papers". To be Code compliant you must comply with Article 16.4: "16.4 Species-group names: fixation of name-bearing types to be explicit. Every new specific and subspecific name published after 1999, except a new replacement name (a nomen novum), for which the name-bearing type of the nominal taxon it denotes is fixed automatically [Art. 72.7], must be accompanied in the original publication 16.4.1. by the explicit fixation of a holotype, or syntypes, for the nominal taxon [Arts. 72.2, 72.3, 73.1.1, 73.2 and Recs. 73A and 73C], and, 16.4.2 where the holotype or syntypes are extant specimens, by a statement of intent that they will be (or are) deposited in a collection and a statement indicating the name and location of that collection (see Recommendation 16C)." Recommendation 16C states: "Preservation and deposition of type specimens. Recognizing that name - bearing types are international standards of reference (see Article 72.10) authors should deposit type specimens in an institution that maintains a research collection, with proper facilities for preserving them and making them accessible for study (i.e. one which meets the criteria in Recommendation 72F)." Thus all you actually need to state is that "the holotype will be deposited in XXX Museum", although in reality it is always better if the holotype is deposited in the institution as soon as possible. It is even better if a specimen that is already in a museum is chosen as the holotype, although that is often not possible. Adam.
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zakvanloocke
Full Member
Looking for some of the rarer USA Sphingidae
Posts: 123
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Post by zakvanloocke on Sept 15, 2014 13:49:42 GMT -8
Being only 22, I haven't given much thought as to what would happen to my collection if I were to pass away or something along the lines me not being able to continue collecting. I appreciate the start of this thread as it has made me realize I need to figure some stuff out!
~Zak
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Post by jackblack on Sept 22, 2014 1:15:27 GMT -8
Interesting reading everyone's ideas and thoughts .I have a reasonable coll of Aussie insects and my main research parts of that coll will go to Qld Museum as a lot of paratype material there and I know the coll is looked after and will be used for research by many taxonomists visiting Australia. Some Genera will go to my friends collectors amateur researchers and the rest my son will take on , maybe he will pursue my work on some or he can decide on what to do with it , he has grown up with my obsession at first and then passion and now it turns to work.But we had and still have memorable field trips and he still remembers the day we caught or pursued various species some going back many years now, thrill of the hunt stays with us all. In Australia the Gov`t offers tax deductions for curated donated collections through the cultural gifts programmes and I have been involved as a recognised valuer to help people.So there can be some monetary compensation there for anyone undecided. But it really boils down to the owner of a collection what they want to do with it , we all have our own ideas , and I agree don`t leave your decision too late and it ends up a burden on your family , a life`s work could go down hill real quick with museum beetles looking after it . Jack
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Post by exoticimports on Sept 22, 2014 7:00:24 GMT -8
I've seen collections that have gone to town museums and non-specialist universities and within years the collection is dust. So I would suggest against leaving a collection to anything but an institute that has focus on insects.
When I have time I plan to sell the commercial stuff.
The material of scientific interest will go to a museum. I haven't ID which one, but I already have material in BMNH, Carnegie, and McGuire. I've also corresponded with Smithsonian and AMNH both of which seem pleased to accept such a collection.
Note that many museums are afraid of USFWS so don't want Ornithoptera, Tienopalpus, etc.
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Post by bugdude56 on Sept 24, 2014 10:38:23 GMT -8
Everything (Coleoptera) will go CAS (California Academy of Sciences, San Francisco).
Unfortunately, the Smithsonian has allowed nebraska to "hold" their scarabaeid specimens, apparently, indefinitely. That's unfortunate. As a result, I do not/will not deposit types of any new taxa I have described/I am describing at the Smithsonian, nor any other type material in my research collection.
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zakvanloocke
Full Member
Looking for some of the rarer USA Sphingidae
Posts: 123
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Post by zakvanloocke on Mar 22, 2015 18:42:57 GMT -8
This is something I have been thinking about more and more frequently as I get older. I am 23 years old now and have already spent a significant amount of time and money on my collection. I can only imagine the number of hours my elder collectors have put into their collections. As of right now my collection is nothing that any museum would want due to its small size and lack of any type specimens. Mine, and I'm sure every amateur entomologists dream is to have the room or rooms lined with cabinets and drawers to appreciate for years. I hope to achieve this someday, but understand that it is unlikely without donations and much more time and money. As to where it will end up, my hope is to find another collector when I am nearing my end who shares my passion for entomology and will care for the collection the same way that I will and have. This is my Lepidoptera, Neuroptera, and Hymenoptera collection. My Coleoptera and other orders are in large cases under my bed at the moment due to not being able to afford any more drawers/cabinets. ~Zak
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Post by Chris Grinter on Mar 23, 2015 9:26:54 GMT -8
In response to a few people above, starting with the most recent:
Zak - just because your collection isn't massive and lacks types doesn't mean a museum wouldn't be interested. As long as you have good data then lots of places would be interested. If you're mostly collecting moths then you very likely can find an institution who would be eager to take your collection. If you have a large butterfly collection this can be a little bit harder. I know the California Academy of Sciences doesn't really want any more California butterfly collections because they don't have the space or need for it. Essentially every species is already represented with huge series in the collection, so growth of the butterflies is a low priority.
BugDude - The Smithsonian has allowed Nebraska to keep the scarabs (I guess not the dung beetles though) because they don't have the time, space, or money to spend curating the collection and keep it active. The arrangement at Nebraska benefits everyone because the collection is now in the hands of experts who can use it on a daily basis, ship loans and grow the collection. The beetles are still property of the Smithsonian. Things would be far worse if they just locked the cabinets and stopped shipping loans (this HAS happened for many orders of insects at the Smithsonian!). Please don't refuse to send them types just because of this reason.
exoticimports - Not all museums are afraid of CITES species - it often depends on what the product is and where it is coming from. CITES only applies to interstate and international commerce. Some states allow for some sales of protected species within the borders, some do not. I do believe you could donate any CITES species to a museum in your state. Here at the Illinois Natural History Survey (along with most major museums) we have a CITES permit. Museums do get worried however when someone can't prove the specimens were legally acquired. If you have CITES species that lack paperwork and are post-1975 they are illegal.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2015 12:59:08 GMT -8
Nice setup Zak, it's always interesting to see the inner sanctum! One thing I've wondered is how those individuals with large personal collections (1,000+ specimens IMO) have time to take care of everything. At this point in time my collection is >100 specimens, although not lacking in quality, but even this is a bit of a hassle. I would imagine 90% of the drawers remain untouched for years at a time. Also, other than scientific study/reference, it seems a bit costly and impractical. Just my opinion, and it would be interesting to hear other replies. Guess I should probably post the lair. I only have a few specimens out at a time if photographing or studying-don't worry guys-the specimens aren't permanent desk toys-but still don't have time to appreciate every bug in the collection.
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Post by eurytides on Mar 23, 2015 16:30:33 GMT -8
Yeah, I've never really thought about what a "big" collection is. I too have just over 100 specimens, and I've been doing this for like 15+ years. I don't buy specimens. Everything I have is self caught, and the majority are raised from ova or larvae, hence the slow accumulation. However, many of my specimens have very detailed data. My specimens have a label with a ref number and basic data, but on my computer, the reference number leads to their full data. If I were to print everything using 12 pt font, the label for many specimens would be like 1/2 to 1/3 page of text. I've always wondered if museums would want my specimens, not rare, but good data. I'm in my early 30s, but it's never too early to plan for "the end."
Dan, I see you have an orchid on your window sill. I also have an orchid collection. Deciding what will happen with that is an even bigger issue because at least the bugs are dead and require only occasional maintenance.
Ideally though, I'd like my specimens to go to a museum, but I haven't actually contacted anyone about that yet. I guess with all the above posts, the point is, nothing's forever. It doesn't matter if you give your specimens to your kids, sell them, donate, place in a museum....I mean, one method might lead to longer preservation over others for a few decades, even centuries, but eventually, nothing lasts forever. Think say, a billion years in the future, will any of our current specimens still be around? Will the human species? Just enjoy them while we/they are around I think....
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2015 18:19:26 GMT -8
Eurytides,
There is a lot of wisdom in the last paragraph you posted. The first large and perfect cacicus I bought was my most valued possession. I remember hiding it in my sock drawer (in an airtight plastic container of course) at college because I was paranoid my roommate or friends would steal/harm the specimen, and only brought it out when I could lock the door and not be disturbed...a bit ridiculous in hindsight, but the feeling persisted long after my first undergrad. I thought maybe if I could put it in Lucite it would be indestructible and alleviate the worries. I researched using a vacuum to get all air bubbles out, sought out professionals, etc. I wasn't 100% sure the Lucite wouldn't yellow after say 50 years, so that idea was out the window. On to museum glass with UV protection, spider silk to hold the specimen in place, assembling the enclosure in a vacuum environment so no oxygen would be present to facilitate decay, and a host of other techniques. After much frustration I had to accept the fact nothing is forever.
I have had this same fear with many things on the planet which conservatives are worried about. Even rainforests, which is a huge topic. When we can terraform the earth and manipulate genetics, speed growth of plants and animals, etc., all of the conservative efforts will seem somewhat silly. This isn't to say we shouldn't worry about these issues until such a point in history, but I don't want to get too far off topic.
The efforts to digitize collections held in museums is a great endeavor and provides a "backup", although the genetics could be lost if not properly sequenced. Even the information on this forum holds significant value. Imagine how much fun historians in 500 years will have browsing through the post, granted it still exists...hopefully the data is backed up somewhere!
I am of the opinion we are on the cusp of such technologies, so no longer worry about such things.
Anyways, orchids are very beautiful and have a few around the house, nothing super rare or exotic though. I have noticed a trend of similar interest with "collectors" (insects, seashells, orchids, mineral specimens, etc), perhaps some innate drive from our forefathers or an aptitude for natural beauty!
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Post by eurytides on Mar 24, 2015 4:19:00 GMT -8
I understand where you are coming from. There have been things I've possessed in my life which are of great personal and sentimental value to me, and which I wanted to hold on to forever. I didn't do the extensive research you did, but I understand your reasons and feelings. But eventually, intellectually, we come to the conclusion that while we can delay the decay of time, we cannot stop or prevent it. Even atoms don't last forever, just a very long time. Digitizing butterfly collections is great, but even the 0s and 1s in our computers fade with time. All storage methods are relative in terms of fidelity and longivity. Like I say, just enjoy our short time here.
Since you are a Star Trek fan, I will no say more than "All Good Things," the last poker scene.
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JKim
New Member
Posts: 17
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Post by JKim on Mar 29, 2019 9:42:48 GMT -8
It sure is an old post, though I would like to participate. As an amateur entomologist when I was young, and majored in entomology, studied and still working as a research entomologist, and also with an experience of curatorial assistant in insect collection in University of Nebraska State Museum (Lincoln, NE, USA). I think I will donate most of my personally collected collections to the museums and institutions depending on the taxon and the taxon that current curator of each institution are working on. Let's say [Institution A] has great collections Lepidoptera and current curator works on Leps. THen I will donate all my Leps to [Institution A]. I have been donating insect collections to couple different collections and institutions within the US and in South Korea.
Based on my experiences as a curatorial assistant in the museum, faculty members (researchers) do not touch a specimen if it does not need to be updated on database or their research subject. However, they do sometime clean up or replace pest deterrent when it runs out. It's not that they don't care, but it's more likely it is not their subject to study, and too busy to care others. (or other reasons). The museum's goal to housing insect collections are to so that visiting scientists or future scientists/faculties can work on those. It's not to display "fancy" insects to public. Our museum had visitors from around the world including the faculties of entomology department of the University of Nebraska-Lincoln. (The state museum is separated from the school as an affiliation, I think).
Anything that I purchased (especially those collection labels only including country and years) lacks information for researches (unless it is very difficult to obtain from wild) will very likely discarded, given away, or donated to a small local museums which do less research with more public displays, public educations. I recently visited an insect museum city owned (I think) has most of insect specimens discolored, and are in TERRIBLE CONDITIONS. I would NEVER EVER donate any of my personally collected insect specimens, unless they are willing to "pay" my specimens. As a research entomologist, that museum needs to be removed, or better take a good care of insect specimens. I know the donor of some great collections in there so I'm well aware some of those are not too old, but were all discolored, faded, and terrible taken cared. They were like a piece of junk.
Entomological institutions where actual researches occurring are far better than such museums available only for public display (obviously).
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